HEMI Wagon Project Log: Update with questions!

"JGrabowMSt" (jgrabowmst) 06/01/2014 at 23:27 • Filed to: HEMIWAGON

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So the wagon has been doing fairly well. The car needs a few things again (general maintenance things), so here's the list:

To Do:

K&N Oil Filter

6qts Royal Purple HPS 5w20

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

To order:
Energy Suspension solid Polyurethane bushings for front/rear
Charger PI style 5 spoke steel wheels
BC Racing Coilovers Front/Rear (not for a few weeks)

I also need to re-think tires. I saw a friend (I only really bump into him at cruise nights), who recently opened a garage with a couple of his friends, and they do import restorations/modifications for 25 years and older, among general repairs. He was telling me that despite the wagon having mix matched tires, the General Altimax tires on it are probably the best budget buy for the car. The ContiPro Contact tires are great, but the Altimax tires have a better tread for my usage, which is not just general usage, it's all season, but has a tread that could support autocross. The tires wouldn't last long doing it, but for basic use tires, they'll do better for me all around given the tread pattern. The full set is also cheaper than the Contis which is a plus. I'm not 100% sold on the General tires (I'm not a fan of Generals overall), but I'll take it if it's a good buy for the car.

Here's another thing I'm thinking of. Stagger the rear wheels, to 9" each, instead of the 7.5 stock. I could send two wheels to Weldcraft Wheels, and they can widen the wheels to 9 for something around $200 a wheel. While that's a fine idea, the wheels themselves aren't even worth half that brand new, so I'm looking for what I can do about that. Going to a 9" rear would let me run a rear tire somewhere in the 290 range, which could drastically increase traction overall, but after beefing up the rear suspension and adjusting the geometry, it could make a huge impact on handling, which is a big thing towards what I want to do. Without spacers or rolling the fenders, the Magnum can support a maximum size of 10" wide wheels with the stock sidewall height. Finding a 290.60R18 tire will be difficult as well, because I don't have the budget to throw some Mickey Thompson or Hoosiers on it. I'll be shopping around for a while. I'm thinking that I'll do a full regular set of four tires, probably the Generals because my friend said it's what he would do, and then later order two more wheels, widen them, and look for some sort of vaguely matching tires in the size I'm looking for. Since that drastically affects the budget for wheels/tires, the wider wheels will be for much, much later.

So once the oil is changed, it's all own to the suspension/wheels/tires. I'm happy about that, because I want to be able to tackle this all at once, rather than taking the car apart, and putting it back together several times seeing mild improvements each time that still leave me wanting more.

So that's that with the Wagon as far as updates that will be happening in the immediate future. Beyond this, if you go back to the first project log post, I have a running list of what I'm looking to do as well as what's already been done. I'm also going to be getting some decals for it, and I'm trying to find a replacement grill insert set for the honeycomb plastic, but not $300, because that's too much.

Arben72 > JGrabowMSt 06/02/2014 at 00:06

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For your tires instead of getting wider wheels and tires, why not get some sticky summers and see if you can find a used winter wheel and tire set on craigslist. It might be cheaper that way, plus wider tires are worse in snow. That way you get the best of both worlds. It'll probably be cheaper in the end too.

JGrabowMSt > Arben72 06/02/2014 at 00:19

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I don't really think the sticky tires will make much of a difference. While this is a bit different than the FR-S/BR-Z, I think that the 225 tires on the Magnum aren't really enough. I can break loose too easily while pulling out of a parking lot, but more importantly, at higher speeds, cornering is a major weakness.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > JGrabowMSt 06/02/2014 at 00:59

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It looks like you might have a few misconceptions on how tire sizes work. A 295/60/18 tire will be a good amount taller than a 225/60/18. In fact, it would be approximately 3.3" taller, with that all being from the sidewalls. The "60" part of that tire size is the aspect ratio, and it is a percentage of the section width. In your case, a 295/45/18 would provide the same rolling diameter.

Lots of good information you can find on the Tire Rack website. I think this would be a good starting point for you to peruse:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech…

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > JGrabowMSt 06/02/2014 at 02:07

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I don't have any autox experience, but from what I've seen, General tires aren't that great. I would look into Continental extreme contact DWS's. Great grip and life, also they wear evenly even if you are running 2-3 degrees of camber and 10+ degrees of caster. They're kind of magical. The generals could be showing cords on the edges but still have7/32" in the middle. Also the idea to run a separate set of wheels/tires for winter and summer, or even street and track use is a great idea, you don't need anything crazy for the street.

JGrabowMSt > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 06/02/2014 at 09:15

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this is why i ask more questions at this point. Once it gets to suspension, wheels and tires, im in foreign grounds. Ill be looking at that link for a while today, thanks!

JGrabowMSt > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 06/02/2014 at 09:21

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Im not opposed to Continental, but in general, the tires seem much softer than other brands. Maybe that contributes to something, im not sure. I can identify problems with tires, but when it comes down to whats best for the wagon, im open to suggestions, because i dont know everything.

Ive seen a couple people run Zeon tires, are these worth looking at, or too cheap or expensive?

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > JGrabowMSt 06/02/2014 at 10:04

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Those are Coopers right? I don't have any experience with them in performance applications, but generally speaking they've been decent for me. Usually softer means more grip. Michelin is also great, but pilot sport a/s plus will wear unevenly and very quickly. I guess you will have the best luck if you don't go for cheap tires, you get what you pay for. Continental is approved by Mercedes, and your chassis has a lot in common with Mercedes, so.... Get nankangs!

JGrabowMSt > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 06/02/2014 at 12:05

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I bring up Cooper Zeons because my family has put Cooper tires on damn near every car we've owned for over 20 years (well over 20 years) with no problems yet.

I played around with a tire size calculator, and I'm working out a couple different tire sizes that will fit the car, and be close, or indistinguishable to the stock size. The good news is that the 225.60R18 tires are not a very forgiving size, there just aren't a lot of options. Continentals are good, but I want to see other options as well.

Changing the size to either 235.55R18 or 245.55R18 gives me a lot more options, and increases the contact patch with the road to boot. Gives me the options of some Pirellis, Goodyears, Coopers and a few more that are all more money that I'm looking to spend. Most importantly, there are more tires to choose from.

The 235.55R18 is the most abundant tire size, slightly smaller than the stock size, but close enough that I wont have to worry about the speedo reading a whole lot different. The 245.55R18 is out there, but requires more shopping around to find selections. Cooper, Nitto, Goodyear, and a few more. Now it's down to some real comparison shopping. These will all easily fit on a stock sized rim as well, which is the biggest goal. Do remember I'm thinking about widening the rims as well.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > JGrabowMSt 06/02/2014 at 12:58

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No problem. A lot of that can be intimidating at first. There's a lot of different numbers that all mean something different, but once you get the hang of it it's all relatively simple. And tire sizes follow the strangest "normal" standard that I know of. "Metric size (mm)" / "Percentage of previous mm" / "Standard size (in)". And thrown in there you also have tire type, speed rating (which is a letter used to represent a metric number). Then further on the sidewall is load capacity (two digit number used to represent a four digit metric number), date of manufacture in a non-pedestrian format (WWYY), and UTQR ratings which are only partially standardized and don't always mean what you think they mean. And then there's tire construction, which we'll just ignore for now. Haha.

I got a tiny bit carried away here. I like tires.

JGrabowMSt > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 06/02/2014 at 14:42

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I took a close look at all the tires on the Magnum, because they don't match (which I'm aware of, and was when I bought the car). I'm thinking of going for a 235.55R18 because it opens the door for a lot more tires, and is very close to the stock size. I need to get new tires on stat, because now I'm aware of why I have an odd noise in the back, it's different tire sizes. But this is taking me back to the wheel issue, because the 18x7.5 wheels are a little limiting, I want to stagger the rear, but to put in $400+ shipping to widen two weeks is a lot. This means that a second dedicate set just for racing will be in the works when I get the rest of the car at that point.

The Cooper Zeons are catching my attention for DD tires. My family has used Coopers for a long time, and while my car as CS4 Touring tires, they're a bit noisy, and I want something quieter for this. There's a sport version of the Cooper Zeons that I'm willing to give a shot when I get around to a second set. I'll have to sit on this for a couple days and see what I can put the money towards, because I'd like to just run the sport Zeons as summer tires, and look at the lower end Zeons for DD winter tires. But since I'm not expressly made of money, this will be difficult.

One thing I see that I'm not quite kosher with is some people reporting top end noise with Royal Purple. I was ready to go with RP over Mobil 1, but it looks like M1 Fully Synthetic is what I'll have to go for. Because of the mileage, I was ready to go for the RP, but I don't want to put oil in, and have trouble with it.